Auto vs. Manual

[Acid Burn]

i really want to get a manual for my first car, but mom says to get an auto since i havent had much practice on a manual and i can barely get my friend's truck started..but what are some of the advantages and disadvantages of auto and manual??

[Pete00]

advantages of manual:
- more fun (but don't tell your mom that :D ).
- better gas mileage.
- more control of the car.
- its cheaper to replace the clutch than it is the brakes.

disadvantages:
- traffic = keep shifting (i don't find it a problem, some do).

well, you can see where i stand 8)

i would suggest taking some driving lessons in a manual car. you don't want to learn on your celica...well, its not adviseable.

[Prafull Koli]

manual...you'l NEVER regret it...auto can get boring..

[THE_PRO]

lol for sure I would say MANUAL, but if you have problem starting a truck, i would say take some lessons drive with it. See how you feel with it then decide if you can live with it.

[subterfuge]

Hi Crystal:

Manual is in my books the way to go!!
Once you have mastered it, you won't look at driving the same way. It's fun! But it also depends on where you drive. If you spend ALOT of time stuck in traffic, then you may want to have the Auto (although stop and go traffic is a great work-out for the left leg..)

[brandon6976]

I've had both .. I like both to be honest. However my 2cents would be if you're going to get a Gt get a manual .. if you're getting a GT-S I personally wouldn't have any preference, the GT-S has the manual mode which isn't the same but its pretty capable for the auto. THe GT is a normal auto that doesn't have the manual mode.

[Prafull Koli]

let's just qualify that...brandon..HAS an auto right now ....hee hee... he loves it!!!!

[brandon6976]

:lol: if I went to a manual I would destroy it .. specially with nitrous .. burn that clutch baby !!!!!!!!!!

[subterfuge]

:shock:

Brandon's car is a friggin' rocket.. If you get a GTS then the Auto is not so bad afterall. Especialy with that manual shift option..

[ieatglue]

I didn't know how to drive stick when I bought my car. It's not that hard. Just takes a bit of practice!

btw: Now that I've had stick, I'm never buying another auto car again!

[Ti Chuot]

Chick w/ Stick??? one word.....SEXXXXYYYYYYY. But i drive an auto (my brother handed his celi down to me to buy an RSX-S manual). But disadvantage for guys w/ manual is that they have to keep their hand on their stick all the time :lol: I put my hand on my girl thigh :lol: or hold her hand while driving hahaha :wink:.

Disadvanatages for Manual: traffic, shifting gears, can't eat while driving :D, stop @ a red light (uphill & downhill), when you break you have to hold down the break and clutch, misshift

Advantages: Just think of all the fun things you can do!!! :D

But go w/ Manual, I would get a manual too (=

[Prafull Koli]

quan..a true playa' at heart!!!!!!!!! :lol:

[brandon6976]

one more disadvantage of a stick is it'll cost more to mod.

If you start adding turbo/supercharger or nitrous you're going to destroy your clutch and possibily even gears depending on the hp jump. Don't have to worry with an auto as the slush box takes care of it all

[unicalex]

well i have an auto.. i like to do other stuff while driving :smile:
but manual cars are faster uhuh.

[psychocelica]

I hate automatics. I will NEVER buy an automatic in my life. They are so boring,they suck for performance driving because they never shift when you want them to,you never have control over the rev range,and it's BORING!

Manuals are the way to go.If it were up to me,every vehicle would be a manual,whether it be a minivan,a Geo,a Lincoln Towncar,you name it. I hate automatics with a passion. People come up with excuses why not to drive a stick and they're just lame.

When I was looking to buy a car,I knew I wanted a stick,I DID NOT want an auto. A majority of the cars that caught my eye looked really good,then I find out it's an automatic,so I walked away from them at that point.

It's not hard to drive a stick.Plus it keeps you in tune with the car and makes you pay attention to your driving,timing shift points and stuff. With an auto,I get lazy and bored and my mind starts to wander and I don't pay attention to driving.

But that's my 5 speeds....I mean 2 cents.

[7th_gen_celica]

First 2 cars i owned were auto. i was always prentending to shift them. then i got my manual celica, learned to drive stik on it. i will never go back to auto.

spent too much time playing with a dead stick... :D

[subterfuge]

The other thing I now HATE about auto is the BIG BREAK PEDAL.

I learned to drive Standard on a 1996 Corola with NO TACH (this involved listening very carefuly to the sound the engine made).

Now when I am forced to drive auto veichals my left foot instinctivly reaches for the clutch when the revs climb.

... unfortunatly it hits the OVERSIZED BREAK pedel and I nearly kill myself..

...... fairly consistantly.. :thumbup:

[Pete00]

i have a nice feeling when driving my manual celica...shifting and such makes me feel connected and one with the car...its an extension of my body...i'm serious :D

[psychocelica]

i have a nice feeling when driving my manual celica...shifting and such makes me feel connected and one with the car...its an extension of my body...i'm serious :D

I practically live in my car,I'm so used to it and everything. It is like an extension of myself. Hell,I even have the Team Toyota baseball cap to go with it... :D

[Acid Burn]

aHhhHHHHHHH!!!! choices!!!! :shock:

well, if i were to learn how to drive a stick my friend wont mind me learning on her truck, but the part that kinda scares me is that it rolls backwards when its on a hill and im always paranoid about someone stopping really close to my car :sad:

[Pete00]

aHhhHHHHHHH!!!! choices!!!! :shock:

well, if i were to learn how to drive a stick my friend wont mind me learning on her truck, but the part that kinda scares me is that it rolls backwards when its on a hill and im always paranoid about someone stopping really close to my car :sad:

well all it takes is practice. if you are very paranoid about it, you can always pull up the hand brake, find the clutch sweet spot, gas it a little and release the hand brake.

something you may want to try. bring the car or truck onto a slight incline. make sure no other cars is around. just keep rolling back and moving forwards, roll back, come forwards etc. just play with the clutch and get a feel for it. :wink:

[THE_PRO]

aHhhHHHHHHH!!!! choices!!!! :shock:

well, if i were to learn how to drive a stick my friend wont mind me learning on her truck, but the part that kinda scares me is that it rolls backwards when its on a hill and im always paranoid about someone stopping really close to my car :sad:

That's okay....try BLOWN ENGINE, if you miss shift kiss good bye to your celica.

[brandon6976]

aHhhHHHHHHH!!!! choices!!!! :shock:

well, if i were to learn how to drive a stick my friend wont mind me learning on her truck, but the part that kinda scares me is that it rolls backwards when its on a hill and im always paranoid about someone stopping really close to my car :sad:

also if you're practiving on a hill and you're afraid of rolling back you just have to put on the handbrake .. then start to go slowly and when you feel the car tug a little let go of the hand brake. There will be no roll back then.

[subterfuge]

Crystal:

Manual is FUN. But it does come with some issues also. Hills are scary at first and they involve a bit of finess to be sure. Best thing to do is to get some practice in first. I let my freind drive my old Corolla a couple of times in a big Parking lot to get the feel for forward, backwards, etc..

Then the next week I let him drive my favorite road.. :D

It's all about developing a 'feel' for the car. Pete's right. You REALY gain an additional connection with your car and what you are doing when you drive a standard.

As to Faisal's comment about a blown engine? Yup. IT's a possiblity. If your driving like hell and you miss-shift then you run that risk. HOwever at regular driving, and getting USED to your car, you should be fine. The GT will do 120ish in third, and since most shift to 5th at 80km (like 60ish mph). You'll be fine. Just take your time when you are starting out, and SLOWLY get used to down-shifts.

[Acid Burn]

what do you guys mean miss-shift?? :shock:

[Prafull Koli]

HAHAHAHAH!!!!1 try it and find out..you'll know almost immediately what mis-shifting is ... :giggle:

[subterfuge]

Miss Shifting is when you .... well miss your shift. You accedentaly shift into a wrong gear..

Its generaly not a 'bad' thing as most miss shifts are done going UP through the gears. If you accedentaly move from 2nd to 5th you 'lug' your engine which is basicly when your engine doesn't have the 'momentium' to carry the higher gear. You simply shift out, and back into the proper gear.

WHen you misshift going DOWN the gears it can potentialy be a big deal. Going from 5th to 2nd or 6th to 3rd (in GTS land) for instance is a very large no-no. You can EASILY rev your car to the red-line and beyond (hense how War got that extra engine he's tinkering with).

If you are paying attention however and not RAMMING it into gear and dropping the clutch, you should notice that there is a problem instantly and be able to shift out of gear before you do anything nasty to your car.

Where people get into trouble is when they are being dumb-asses to start with. IE drop shifting to catch up to somone where they drop the clutch and PUNCH the accelerator before taking the time to realize that they might be in a wrong gear..

Owchy.. Very expensive lesson..

But again. If you take your time, and respect both your veichal and your abilities you will have NO problems and WILL have a GREAT deal of fun.. :D

[Acid Burn]

^^ lol, well i dont wanna wait till then to see, my friend might not be too happy if i broke her truck O_O ummm, how can you go from 6th gear to 3rd?? i thought the thing goes in a zig zag??

[subterfuge]

^^ lol, well i dont wanna wait till then to see, my friend might not be too happy if i broke her truck O_O ummm, how can you go from 6th gear to 3rd?? i thought the thing goes in a zig zag??

Nope. More of an H Pattern. :D

5 Speed
1 3 5
| - | - |
2 4 R

6 Speed (I think)
1 3 5 R
| - | - |- l
2 4 6

(course the R. might be in a differnt location, but you get the drift.. :D )

[Prafull Koli]

nice diagram sub..i was wondering how on earth you were gonna show that...very creative!!

[Diesel Dud]

i really want to get a manual for my first car, but mom says to get an auto since i havent had much practice on a manual and i can barely get my friend's truck started..but what are some of the advantages and disadvantages of auto and manual??

manual is good
automatic is not

[Diesel Dud]

acid dont worry i learned manual in 2 days with my car

[psychocelica]

i really want to get a manual for my first car, but mom says to get an auto since i havent had much practice on a manual and i can barely get my friend's truck started..but what are some of the advantages and disadvantages of auto and manual??

manual is good
automatic is not

I think you should win a Nobel Peace Prize for that discovery. :lol:

[psychocelica]

The fun stick. A must on any car.

http://images.cardomain.com/member_img_a/330000-330999/330323_4.jpg

[psychocelica]

wow,linking my pics from cardomain sucks.

[Diesel Dud]

wow,linking my pics from cardomain sucks.

hey how do u do that from cardomain
there is no URL for the pics...

[Acid Burn]

what is the difference between 5 speed and 6 speed?? :?

[Burrcold]

other then the obvious of there being an extra gear to go through...the gear ratios are shorter

[CONTROL ONE]

i don't even consider auto's cars...

sorry but if your into performance in the least with an import, manual is the way to go

brandon, you know my thoughts on this...think of every excuse you want, my $8000 cheaper 5spd GT is faster than your auto GT-s

i just don't see any advantage to auto...at all. i learned to drive standard on my celi off the dealership lot, it's really not that difficult, just think logically

and whoever said a girl driving standard is hot is absolutely right! i find it so hot when a girl can drive my car properly

and for the ppl saying 'i like to do stuff with my gf so i got an auto' c'mon, get back to reality, i mean how often are you shifting gears anyways?? you'd be amazed what you can get away with with a manual, you just have to be careful not to hit her head too hard on the downshifts :wink:

so my answer...GET A MANUAL

[subterfuge]

what is the difference between 5 speed and 6 speed?? :?

As stated there is an extra gear..

But in the Celica's case it's also very justified due to the difference in the design of the GT vs. GTS engines. The GTS is designed to get the meat of it's power off of the high end portion of the power band when the engine hits 'Lift'. The gears in this case are to be closer ratio. That is, there is less of a differnce between the 'start range' of one gear and the 'end range' of the other (totaly the wrong terminolgoy, but I'm not a car dude). Because the gears are closer together you don't end up 'dropping' the RPMs as much from one shift to another, thereby (supposedly) alowing you to keep your car in the 'happy power zone'.

The GT though is a different beastie. Although our engine's basicly crap out about the same time as the GTS starts getting going, all of OUR power is at the bottom of the spectrium (We have 40 hp less but we only have 5 pounds LESS torque then our GTS brethren, and we get it at like 4500rpm vs like 6500rpm). So off the mark I've notice that I am at LEAST as fast if not faster..

however.. Once the GTS hits lift.. We get our ASSES handed to us.. In VERY short order..

The GTS Auto isn't exactly like a regular Auto either. Although it has fewer 'gears' to move through, it shifts VERY agressivly (as I can personaly attest to having nearly shat myself in Brandon's Black Beast on two differnt occations now). The Manual Shift mode allows you to shift gears from the stearing wheel, which would be VERY nice for doing track racing, etc.. After being in Brandon's car I have VERY much respect for it.

[CONTROL ONE]

hate to burst your bubble mark but the GT 5M is PROVEN to be faster than the Gt-s 4A

[Diesel Dud]

GT 140 hp @ 6400 rpm, 125 lb*ft torque @ 4200 rpm
GT-S 180 hp @ 7600 rpm, 130 lb*ft torque @ 6800 rpm

as you can see, GT attains it max potential at lower rpms
anyone got the specs on the GT-s at 6400rpm and 4200 rpm to compare hp and torque on a relative level??

[Diesel Dud]

hate to burst your bubble mark but the GT 5M is PROVEN to be faster than the Gt-s 4A

control i thought u had a GT-S

[brandon6976]

sorta .. my auto has been modded a fair bit for performance.. not to many people bother to mod the auto's .. however if done right it can be very nice .. anywayz you have your thoughts, most of the guys saw it tonight :D

I probably shoulda gone stick for what i'm doing .. but auto is cheaper in the long run, specially for what my long term goals are for the car. I don't regret it. I've gone shooting around with Brent, from pretty much a stand still (like 40-60km) he was pulling a little but once the speed got up we were evenly matched, to be fair everything I've done could be done to a stick and make the stick that much more faster. However none of you have followed my path so :D

[ieatglue]

hate to burst your bubble mark but the GT 5M is PROVEN to be faster than the Gt-s 4A

Grant dude, there is no way a gt manual is faster than a gts.

You need to qualify the word faster. If you're talking 0-60 that may be the case, but there will be a point there the extra 40 hp over takes the gt, no mater how good of a shifter you are. That's just WAY too much power to make up.

[Acid Burn]

kinda lost now, gear ratios are shorter meaning? you'd have to shift more frequently?? O_o

[subterfuge]

kinda lost now, gear ratios are shorter meaning? you'd have to shift more frequently?? O_o

Yup!! You've got it!! :D

They are shorter, which means again that your engine's RPM's don't drop as much between shifts.

But the drawback is that you spend more time shifting..
.... wait... that's not a drawback! That's more fun!!! :D

... unless you are in stop-n-go traffic on the DVP.. :mad:

:D

[brandon6976]

hate to burst your bubble mark but the GT 5M is PROVEN to be faster than the Gt-s 4A

Grant dude, there is no way a gt manual is faster than a gts.

You need to qualify the word faster. If you're talking 0-60 that may be the case, but there will be a point there the extra 40 hp over takes the gt, no mater how good of a shifter you are. That's just WAY too much power to make up.

Depends .. if you live your life 1/4mile at a time :giggle:

-Yo dude what you got there
-More than you can arrford buddy... Ferrari ~vroom vroom~
-Turns head ... SMOKE HIM

[CONTROL ONE]

hate to burst your bubble mark but the GT 5M is PROVEN to be faster than the Gt-s 4A

Grant dude, there is no way a gt manual is faster than a gts.

You need to qualify the word faster. If you're talking 0-60 that may be the case, but there will be a point there the extra 40 hp over takes the gt, no mater how good of a shifter you are. That's just WAY too much power to make up.

of fine, to CLARIFY, the GT 5M is faster than a GT-s 4A in the 0-60, 1/8 mile, 1/4 mile

is that enough for you? i don't know what other kind of racing you do?!?!

sorry but they don't have '3 honks at 100 km/h and then take off' at the track...

[brandon6976]

nop they don't ..but I've never even been to the track .. I do my driving on the road .. if I wanted a track car I wouldn't have bought an import
:?

Anywayz its fair to say I don't regret it but Grant doesn't like the auto

[CONTROL ONE]

just to back up my statement i'd be willing to go anyone with a gt-s auto

they took a transmission MEANT for short, 6spd gearing and KILLED with with a slushbox of a 4speed auto.

a stock gt-s auto runs 17 second 1/4 mile times. that's about as fast as the average minivan

on the flipside, a stock GT manual will run mid 15s stock.

i still don't see how you think an auto will be cheaper in the end? if you know how to drive, and don't beat your engine like it owed you money, your clutch will last your 100K+ easily

whatever you say, it'll never change my mind that the extra 10K+ for an auto gt-s is the biggest waste of money in my mind

frankie had one for 1 yr, hated it, traded it in. byron has had his for over 2 yrs and is really unhappy about the performance. lets face it, with an engine that has relatively NO TORQUE, you NEED a high revving engine to get the HP out of if; which is simply just not possible with an auto...

and another thing :D

the HP difference b/t a GTM and GT-sA is NOT 40hp, that's a proven fact.

manual cars have roughly 12-15% loss from the crank (where stock hp is measured) and the actual hp it puts down to the wheels whereas an auto typically nets losses of 20%+

That puts the REAL GT hp at around 120-125hp and the GT-s at 144hp which is a difference of only +-20hp to the wheels

now add to that

1) the GT is lighter than the GT-s
2) a standard is lighter than an auto
3) with bolt ons, there will be LESS of a loss through the crank with a manual (once again, 12% vs 20%)

shall i go on?

[brandon6976]

well my car is no where near complete as yours is .. but when it is I'll race ya :D .. might win might lose who knows

Also you are right the power lose is about 5-10% more on an auto but the hp is still higher but you have higher gearing blah blah blah .. the discussion can go on forever .. i could talk about shift kits, torque converts (which frankie nor byron looked at) ... I think its fair to say one day when my car is more complete like yours we can race and just find out .. right now you and I are just bench racing :D

[Burrcold]

amongst all this friendly argueing, I managed to learn more about these engines from you guys then I ever knew before...awesome facts guys! :) I have always wondered this aswell

[subterfuge]

WEEEEEEE!!! :D

2003 C7 Quarter Mile Battle!!!

I'll sponcer the Trophy!!!!!!!

(we could make a collective trip to St. Thomas!!!)

((oh and appologies to Crystal for hijacking her thread.. :smile: ))

[CONTROL ONE]

well my car is no where near complete as yours is .. but when it is I'll race ya :D .. might win might lose who knows

Also you are right the power lose is about 5-10% more on an auto but the hp is still higher but you have higher gearing blah blah blah .. the discussion can go on forever .. i could talk about shift kits, torque converts (which frankie nor byron looked at) ... I think its fair to say one day when my car is more complete like yours we can race and just find out .. right now you and I are just bench racing :D

i don't really understand this comment

i have an injen cai and hks exhaust

you have an injen cai and custom cat back exhaust

how is that not equal?

what are you saying, that once you get a torque converter, shift kit, and your 50 shot of nitrous installed THEN we'll be equal?!?! how does that make any sense?

i'm saying my GT with i/e bolt ons is faster than your GT-s with i/e bolt ons

last time i checked my body kit, wing, hood and interior dye didn't make my car go any faster ...

[brandon6976]

I was thinking the header gives you another 10 or so hp :D
You also have the lightweight racing rims. I don't think either of our cars is going to be the situation you're talking about which is I/E

[CONTROL ONE]

I was thinking the header gives you another 10 or so hp :D
You also have the lightweight racing rims. I don't think either of our cars is going to be the situation you're talking about which is I/E

the header maybe able to fetch another 8hp max at the wheels

my rims are 14.2lbs, stock gt rims are only 15.x. not much of a difference from stock...

[Diesel Dud]

last time i checked my body kit, wing, hood and interior dye didn't make my car go any faster ...

if you guys really wanna get some acceleration gain you should go for the TRD badge like mine

[subterfuge]

last time i checked my body kit, wing, hood and interior dye didn't make my car go any faster ...

if you guys really wanna get some acceleration gain you should go for the TRD badge like mine

:giggle:
Or go for the TRD Mud-Flaps. They're BOOYAH-HELLA fast!!! 5+ HP measured at the DEALERSHIP..

[white_rice]

I think to sum things up Crystal, everyone can agree that you should get the manual transmission!

[ieatglue]

I TOTALLY would love to see the race. I'll go buy a wrestling belt and I'll give it to the winner.

Let's organize it!

Actually, I'm sure we'll have some fine examples come poker run may 3rd, but if you want to do it before hand. I'd love to see it!!!

I'd also like to see a bone stock gt vs a i/e/h gt just to see how much of a difference it makes....


Then we can post all the movies on our site, and I guess that would settle all these arguments once and for all!

[CONTROL ONE]

i'd be up for that john

are you stock?

[MM2000GTS]

I'd like to see this.

[subterfuge]

http://forums.c7performance.com/viewtopic.php?t=1311

Lets make it happen....
... in a fashion that won't send any of our members to jail..

I'm in..

[CONTROL ONE]

i'm in

[Ti Chuot]

Grant, i'm guessing you have a GT manual. So whoever live next to him w/ an auto GTS race him. don't use your hand shifter, just race in 2, L then Drive. trust me, i took on a 4x4 truck (ford), a volkwagen jetta (200 hp), all manual. It took me off the line, but just about 20 meter in, i comes in front. And Grant, saying 5M will beat an auto is BS man. I'll agreed that you have a better start, but GT beating a GT-S?? 140 hp and 180 hp?? please don't tell me shifting(manual vs auto) will covered up that 40 hp differential. My brother drive a manual RSX-S and i keep up w/ him pretty good. But everyone has different perspective, that's mine. :thumbup:

BTW: 2000 manual are faster than 2001+ models. 0-60 (2000) = 6.6 sec and 0-60 (2001+) = 7.6 sec. This information i got it from an automotive magazine.

[CONTROL ONE]

Ti, read my post about power loss through the transmission

the difference in hp b/t the auto gt-s and manual gt is NOT 40hp, it's roughly around 20-22hp depending on the car.

ALSO keep in mind that extra 20-22hp is ONLY available to the gt-s in LIFT and since the auto gt-s can't remain in lift as long as the standard gt-s, that ALSO hinders it's performance...

i'm not BSing here dude, i'm stating my opinion and backing it up with PROVEN facts

do i think my manual gt is a fast car? HELL NO, i still live in reality, and i personally don't think any celica is a FAST car. i would consider the gt-s 6m a very quick car for what it is, and i think the gt 5m is peppy/quick

all i've ever tried to say through like 20 posts so far on this topic is that the manual gt is faster (0-60, 1/8m, 1/4m)

that is all :D

[MM2000GTS]

I've seen a lot of discussion mentioning facts, but haven't seen any footnotes relating to where those facts have come from. To me, objective information would come from the auto manufacturer, a reliable magazine, or other non-partisan source - e.g not owners themselves making personal experience claims.

This is a very intriguing debate to me, so I've tried to find some objective GT 5M, GT Auto, GT-S 6M and GT-S Auto times, but haven't been successful on the automatic side.

Personally, I'd guess that the auto GT-S would win a 1/4 mile race, but that's just my guess. I think that's what would make a test between a GT 5M and GT-S auto so interesting. Until the rubber hits the road in a true test, who knows.

[Prafull Koli]

wow...I had no idea there was so much interest...let's see it happen boyz...

[subterfuge]

The Drag series is a REALY fun event Prafull. Differnt set of enthusists all together. Worth a look-see if you've never been..

I've only been once, but it was quite the enviroment.

[Burrcold]

Ti had mentioned that the 2000 GT manual is faster in the 0 - 60 then the 2001+ GT manuals....is this proven?

[B-WRX]

Ah.... magazine racing is so much fun.......

[brandon6976]

I like to call it bench racing .. everyone sitting in a chair yelling how fast their car that they're aren't in is :giggle:

[Diesel Dud]

thereis so much interest and contraversy cause it would be real hard for all you AT GT-S drivers to be smoked by a MT GT after paying sooooo much more for your car

[ieatglue]

Yeah Grant I have a bone stock Gt (actually it's got a K&N drop in filter)

but if you want I'll put the butterfly and stock filter in. I'll even put the old antenna on!

We'll get Brandon, and we'll all go to an abandon parking lot or something sometime during the week and give it a whirl.

I'm not entirely sure how it'll turn out, but I'm really interested to see everything in action.

Alex has a good video camera.

btw: Check the other post about mods. Looks like you've got the money for your dyno's...

[CONTROL ONE]

Sandro: buhahahahahahaha, good one man, exactly what i was thinking!

John: sounds good, empty parking lot sounds like the safest bet, and by the way, please don't tell me what i do, and don't have the money for...

[Diesel Dud]

Yeah Grant I have a bone stock Gt (actually it's got a K&N drop in filter)

but if you want I'll put the butterfly and stock filter in. I'll even put the old antenna on!

We'll get Brandon, and we'll all go to an abandon parking lot or something sometime during the week and give it a whirl.

I'm not entirely sure how it'll turn out, but I'm really interested to see everything in action.

Alex has a good video camera.

btw: Check the other post about mods. Looks like you've got the money for your dyno's...

ya have alex with the hot asian bod to bring the camera
i wanna be there via satellite

[MannyGT-S]

I would like to see this race. I have never heard of any stock GT doing a mid 15 though. I though more of a low 16 second car. Sport Compact Car got a mid 15 out of the GT-S :shock: Obviously driver makes a difference. I mean for godsake Micronrice of nc.org did 14.8 stock with a 2002! And a 14.3 with an Injen which is unbeleivable ( the only reason I think its legite is cause I have never heard anyone say B.S on him so he must have proof). I have heard of some modded GT's doing low 15's though. Supposedly the GT responds very well to mods! Kinda like the GT-S! :D

[CONTROL ONE]

matt, scotty01 and daksgt both ran mid 15s bone stock

if i were to guestimate (i know, how accurate eh?) i would say i would be able to hit 15.1-15.3 with i/h/e and lightweight rims

[Burrcold]

I totally agree with Grant on this one...15.1, 15.3 is doable with his mods...side note: I have driven an auto GT-S and I drive a 2000 stick GT and I would have to say that it would be a close race...but I do think it is possible for the GT to take it. (not a bias evaluation haha yah right :D )

[MannyGT-S]

matt, scotty01 and daksgt both ran mid 15s bone stock

if i were to guestimate (i know, how accurate eh?) i would say i would be able to hit 15.1-15.3 with i/h/e and lightweight rims

Just out of curiousity can you guestimate my ride (and I can hit lift shifting to all gears with a sick 4000RPM launch) i have and Injen CAI, TRD shortshift, TRD exhaust, soon to have GT rims and I will remove my tire in the trunk... This is for the track of course.. I thought I should hit a mid 14 or atleast a 14.7...

[Prafull Koli]

if brandon launched @ higher rpm i think this race would be over for the GT...my guess..but what does everybody else think...

[CONTROL ONE]

how long have you been driving strandard matt?

if you literally readline all gears (well up to 4 at least on the track) and slip the clutch a little (power shift) you could probably hit 14.8-14.9x

14.7 or less might be a bit difficult w/o an lsd

[brandon6976]

lol well I don't have the high stall torque converter yet .. I probably won't this year either unless my money tree starts to grow this year :giggle:

[Pete00]

i'd be up for a race :D

[Prafull Koli]

let it rain...let it rain!!!!!!!!!!

[Burrcold]

i'd be up for a race

:lol: I dont think you have much to worry about Pete

[CONTROL ONE]

i'd be up for a race :D

can i have a head start? :P

[Pete00]

i'd be up for a race

:lol: I dont think you have much to worry about Pete

:lol:



i'd be up for a race :D

can i have a head start? :P

sure we can do both. i have the 02 handicap though :cry:

[CONTROL ONE]

hey it might be a fairly decent race then. i was messin around with brent before he got the swap, intake and exhaust

ok, so here's how it stands

me vs. john (modded gt vs stock gt)
me vs. brandon (modded gt vs modded auto gt-s)
me vs. pete (modded gt vs 02 handicapped gt-s)

anyone else want a piece? :wink:

[MannyGT-S]

how long have you been driving strandard matt?

if you literally readline all gears (well up to 4 at least on the track) and slip the clutch a little (power shift) you could probably hit 14.8-14.9x

14.7 or less might be a bit difficult w/o an lsd

I dont really get that though. I've been driving standard for 3 years. I have the best I/E combo you can buy for my car and a TRD SS, my car would be identical to the weigh of a GT or even less and my car has 40HP and 5lbs/trq more stock, a closer range gearbox and that would get me 4 tenths faster then your guestimate on your car.. the math dont add up to me as I would rip a modded GT a new asshole anyday of the week... I'm just puzzled now... :? How in the name of God did Micronfice hit a 14.3 with an Injen CAI and 2002 rev limiter?

[brandon6976]

hehe get a RSM boys .. all you do is find some flat open pavement and you do your own 1/4mile .. gets all the stats and you can tweak your car run again and again until the cows come home

[CONTROL ONE]

just try for yourself man, i don't know how good of a driver you are...

there's no way to accurately predict it unless you go to the track

did you beat that modded type r?

[Prafull Koli]

we should make this part of the next c7 event...instead of a parking lot fiasco..make it a 1/4 race down @ st-thomas or the other race strips..it's gonna be more controlled, safe, legal, and we'll get some good crowds to judge the final results!!

[CONTROL ONE]

meh...parking lot is fine for me, this is just for fun anyways

[Prafull Koli]

nah....time to raise the bar to something more interesting....let's do it the right way!! at the tracks we can even get actual times..no more "guesstimates" and heresay...

[brandon6976]

we'll figure out something when the time comes .. no need to set the location in stone yet

[CONTROL ONE]

raise the bar to something more interesting?

we haven't even done anything yet...

[MannyGT-S]

just try for yourself man, i don't know how good of a driver you are...

there's no way to accurately predict it unless you go to the track

did you beat that modded type r?

Me and Ben havent run officially yet. We have cruised together. We did zap it once down Mavis after turning from the highway. He turned first and shifted nicely from first to second. Then I turned right after let it rip powershifted first to second landed right at 6100RPM. He heard me squak tires and was just at VTEC in 2nd (he told me). So he let it hang too. But I was already flying by him and he was going so fast he almost rearended a minivan, so he had to switch lanes. At that point it was over as I was far ahead. Like i said just playing around but when I was in Lift and he was in VTEC I was pulling. But he may say the minivan was in the way? So who knows... All I remember is flying by the ITR! :D

[MannyGT-S]

nah....time to raise the bar to something more interesting....let's do it the right way!! at the tracks we can even get actual times..no more "guesstimates" and heresay...

Just want to mention cars run different on the street then at the track... I know numerous B16 civics that run low 15's on the track and eat stock ITR's on th street.. Then I see the same ITR's running 14.8's at the track.... makes no sense I know!

[Pete00]

for performance mods, i only have a blitz intake, springs, and trd rear strut bar :| but i'll still run.

[Prafull Koli]

well...instead of all this "talk" ...why not take it the track ...we're planning a meet there anyways so it would be the perfect opportunity, and ofcourse a good time too..

besides there we'll be runnig other cars too besides celicas...

[Ti Chuot]

Ti had mentioned that the 2000 GT manual is faster in the 0 - 60 then the 2001+ GT manuals....is this proven?

It's for GT-S Burrcold, not for GT :D. It's those automotive magazine with car listing and 0-60 speeds, cost, and others.

[Burrcold]

It's for GT-S Burrcold, not for GT . It's those automotive magazine with car listing and 0-60 speeds, cost, and others.

ohh ok hehe could this be because of the rev limiter maybe?

[CONTROL ONE]

yes, it's cuz of the 2K2 premature fuel cutoff

pra, i don't plan on going to the track meet and since i'm the centre of attention here, i would prefer somewhere local :D

i'm not burning up $1000+ tires to race 10+ times. i just wanted to race a couple times to see how my car does

[subterfuge]

Welll ye all can play in the parking lot.. But I'd rather head to St. Thomas. There are other things to watch then just you guys make side bets with one another.

The other thing I would like to see is I-Eat-Glue vs. Me..

His car used to be faster then mine.. And we now have nearly identical "mods" (battle of the High flow filters K&N vs. TRD) But since that full synth oil change. MAN.. It feels like I have new wheels.. :D

[MM2000GTS]

how long have you been driving strandard matt?

if you literally readline all gears (well up to 4 at least on the track) and slip the clutch a little (power shift) you could probably hit 14.8-14.9x

14.7 or less might be a bit difficult w/o an lsd

I dont really get that though. I've been driving standard for 3 years. I have the best I/E combo you can buy for my car and a TRD SS, my car would be identical to the weigh of a GT or even less and my car has 40HP and 5lbs/trq more stock, a closer range gearbox and that would get me 4 tenths faster then your guestimate on your car.. the math dont add up to me as I would rip a modded GT a new asshole anyday of the week... I'm just puzzled now... :? How in the name of God did Micronfice hit a 14.3 with an Injen CAI and 2002 rev limiter?

Again, more quotations of numbers without proof. It will be interesting to see how things go in real life.

Regardless, I know I can get my car down between 9.0-9.6 seconds in the 1/4 mile, and can prove it.

If I recall my physics correctly:

1/4 mile = 400m

Gravity = 9.8 meters/second^2

distance = (1/2)(accelleration)(time^2)
400=(1/2)(9.8m/s/s)(t^2)

Solve that for time (t) in seconds, and you'll come up with 9.03s. That's how long my car would take to hit the ground dropped from 400m (1/4 mile). Sorry, I don't have the time to pull the wind resistance and terminal velocity factors into the mix right now.

Not sure that's correct - I'm a biz major.....

So, by the looks of things, I'd take Grant by about 6.5s, and Matt by 5.5s. But I wouldn't have much of a car left, I guess.

[brandon6976]

whats your second car ? :giggle:

[ieatglue]

John: sounds good, empty parking lot sounds like the safest bet, and by the way, please don't tell me what i do, and don't have the money for...

I'm sorry Grant I think you misunderstood me. What I ment to say is that, _WE'VE_ raised 90 bucks for dynos (I'll even add another 10 so I don't seem like a cheap ass).

We'd love if you could dyno your car after your header install with _our_ hundred bucks...

Believe me, as someone who values the buck, I'd never tell you what to spend your money on.

Back to racing....

Does anyone have one of those GTech things? Do they work? Would they be of any use during the races?

[MannyGT-S]

[quote=CONTROL ONE]quote]

Does anyone have one of those GTech things? Do they work? Would they be of any use during the races?

If used correctly they can be close. Obviously not exact but close. You can use it anytime so it will work during a race, Ususally Gtech times are 2-3 tenths faster then the track time you would get..

[Prafull Koli]

soooooooooooooo...let's take it the track, straight line 1/4 races..so there's no undue wear & tear..and so it's clean, legal, and accurate...

oh yeah, and grant this is a c7 event we had already planned months ago, so you're involvement isn't the main attraction...but since you have an interest in a few 1/4 mile times you should come too.

Like I said earlier we're also gonna have other teg & civic clubs represent that day

[CONTROL ONE]

[quote=CONTROL ONE]quote]

Does anyone have one of those GTech things? Do they work? Would they be of any use during the races?

If used correctly they can be close. Obviously not exact but close. You can use it anytime so it will work during a race, Ususally Gtech times are 2-3 tenths faster then the track time you would get..

john, are you serious? if someone else is paying, hell i'd let you drive my car to the dyno! hehe

[subterfuge]

John is serious, and so am I.

The Header is a hell of a deal 'IF' it delivers what it says it does. Otherwise it's very expensive snakewater..

I'd be happy to invest $40-$50 to keep myself from wasting $500+.

Not to mention it's friggin cool, since no-one yet has had the gahonies to actualy provide before/after dyno's with this product..

[MannyGT-S]

John is serious, and so am I.

The Header is a hell of a deal 'IF' it delivers what it says it does. Otherwise it's very expensive snakewater..

I'd be happy to invest $40-$50 to keep myself from wasting $500+.

Not to mention it's friggin cool, since no-one yet has had the gahonies to actualy provide before/after dyno's with this product..

How much is it to dyno? We have been invited to join TorontoIntegras dyno day if you guys are interested. I think it is 30-40 bux to run it...

[CONTROL ONE]

John and Mark,

i'm hosting a 'Install Meet' at my house tomorrow. there's about 10-12 guys coming to help put in the header, should be good times

oh, and i'm offering FREE BEER to anyone that shows up as well

here's the address:

407/401W
exit on Mavis - go North
Mavis will change to Chinguacousy at Steeles Ave, keep going
Pass Highway 7
1st Right after Highway 7 - Duffield (big yellow castle on the right)
1st Left - Penbridge
#47
(it's about 10 mins from KK in mississauga)

905-840-0690

hope to see you guys there, we can talk more about the dyno then

[brandon6976]

so much for the dyno idea if you're installing it tomorrow :giggle: